Will you pay the federal tax?

[WinstonSmith]

As I hope you know, the U.S. Congress is engaged in a back and forth battle to fund SCHIP, a government children's health insurance program, with a 61 cents per pack increase in cigarette tax.

This is a double whammy representing everthing we gather here against: first, it is a disguised attempt to move America into socialized medicine; second, it is yet another effort to increase the tax burden on consumers of tobacco.

(FYI, you should know that congress' current public approval rating is currently 11%, the lowest in history. The president isn't doing too well either. His is about 26%. The media was quite eager to talk about approval ratings when Bush's was in the teens. They seem to be suddenly quiet on the subject as of late.)

The increased tax does not necessarily mean that you will see a 61 cent increase in the price of cigarettes. Big Tobacco sometimes makes internal adjustments to lower the product price to somewhat compensate for the tax increase.

Regardless of whether of how much the price of a pack goes up, when and if this tax goes into effect, I'll tell you now, I'm not paying it.

I have to admit that I'm a johnny-come-lately on this, because I've continued to buy pre-packaged big tobacco cigarettes while other tax increases came along to serve similar misguided principles.

This particular tax perhaps a final battleground in this country in a battle against encroaching socialism. To the public, it probably seems to be an issue of those damn smokers against the precious little children. In reality, what's at stake here has little to do with smoking or children. It's about winning a very important battle in moving our nation toward socialism.

(By the way, am I the only one who's noticed that all of the needy children in the news articles on this subject have, in particular, asthma. Never a broken arm, never the chicken pox, but asthma. Think about it.)

So, for me, I'm going to become a quick student in rolling my own. If that solution doesn't work out, then I just won't smoke anymore. I'm not feeding this beast, no way, no how. It's not about smoking, folks. You're not on this board because your so damn devoted to tobacco filled sticks; you're on this board because you recognized the greater danger involved when you were among the first victims of a force that has much more dangerous ramifications than the issue of smoking versus not smoking.

So, if it comes to be, will you pay this tax?

[gilster]

Winston, RYO is going up too, but not as much, in the proposed legislation.

Switch over anyways, RYO is great and less exorbitant taxes - even if the legislation passes.

[383rr]

Good post, Winston. I am here because I see this for what it really is, another power-grab on the road to full-blown socialism.

Do we really fight for smoking alone? I don't. It's the first front in the all out war on personal freedom, so it deserves attention, and the hope that we could stop them here (at the smoking issue) was what we were hoping for.

Really, in all truth, I don't see that happening. So many people are used to feeding at the government teat now that this sort of thing seems to be more acceptable to the masses.

I have said for some time now, that as long as people can flick a light switch, flush a toilet, turn up a thermostat, and eat mickie d's, they will remain complacent. Nothing has affected the masses in this regard at this time (well, actually it HAS) so, they keep their heads buried in the sand.

What we do here is extremely important, however.

I know a few folks that have read FORCES pages, and they are coming around to a better understanding of these issues. We are having an impact, but it will be a hard row to hoe for awhile yet, I'm afraid.

So far as the tax issue goes, I haven't bought pre-mades in quite awhile now, so they haven't been getting my money. The tax increase is relatively small on RYO products, so they won't be able to fund this nightmare off of just that.

If the taxes on RYO increase further, (which they will, we're on the radar screen now) I will most likely cut waaaaaay back,or attempt to grow my own.

Only time will tell.

I know one thing... freedom is the most important, precious thing there is. We must never give up.

[LyndaF]

Winston,

My breaking point was last year's election here in Arizona. There was a program on the ballot for "children's early education" that the governor here had been trying to get off the ground for years. No one wanted to fund it, so it never happened. Last year they got the brilliant idea to fund it with a new 80-cent per pack tax on cigarettes (and ONLY on cigarettes) and proudly announced that in all their media ads. Since ONLY cigarette smokers were targeted the bill passed. I decided then NOT to pay "for the children". Especially since the majority of those "children" belong to non-smokers who didn't want to help pay for this program that was to benefit their own children.

I've been rolling my own since February, and while it is a little bothersome at times (when I'm feeling lazy), it's actually not bad at all. I pop in a DVD I've seen dozens of times (so I'm not having to actually look at the tv) and roll out a weeks worth of smokes in the time the movie plays (sometimes a little longer depending on how fast or slow I'm making them). This way, I'm only doing it once a week, while watching a movie (so I'm not zoning out). Works out great for me.

Come spring, I'll be growing my own, and in doing that, I'll not be paying taxes at all (ok, except on the tubes).

I just refuse to pay extortion any longer.

[tnsmoker]

Lynda! I'll trade you home-baked goodies for home-grown tobacco.

[WinstonSmith]

I don't want to divulge too much here, but I'll tell you that I work in health insurance and, nowadays, that almost means by definition that you work managing some contracted government program or another.

About 10 hours ago, I was sitting in a meeting where the report was produced showing how many claims we had paid for... dead people.

On request, the report was put on the table. It was 4 inches thick, with about 30 names on each side of each page.

In other words, giving a conservative estimate, we paid claims with government funds for at least 30,000 dead people. If each claim was for an average of $20.00 (fat chance, I'm being conservative in my estimate), this means that we paid 6 MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF GOVERNMENT FUNDS in claims out to DEAD PEOPLE.

What was the reaction around the table? Did anyone scream in protest at this outrage?

Nah. No one said a word. You see, this par for the course. A common occurrence. You see, it's not anyone's money; it's government money. It didn't even occur to anyone to think anything of it, nonetheless be outraged. It's just the way it is.

To be upset would be kind of dumb considering that we flush away at least $5 million a month on similar mismanagement.

Oh, I see, you think the government would be upset if they knew how we threw their money around.

I'm sorry, I forgot to mention, they're in attendance at these meetings where these things are discussed and are really the cause of this behavior because they mandate the rules by which the money is wasted.

Government employees don't care if you give away $10 million to dead people because, again, it's not their money.

I sat in a meeting where we talked for twenty minutes about blowing at least a million bucks on sending each participant in the government program a Christmas card. Just so they could feel good about being in the government program, of course.

I'd say that the government program that I help manage throws at least $50 Million a year out the window without even batting an eye.

[LyndaF]

Lynda! I'll trade you home-baked goodies for home-grown tobacco.

Deal

[Jemeyes]

money is wasted

50 million, 10 million, 1 million,

Why? ..and why dosen't the government care that "money is being wasted"?

where is this "holding politicians and goverment accountible" for wastefull spending bill

[WinstonSmith]

Actually, I made a mathematical error. That one report represented about $600,000, not 6 MILLION.

But today we revised it to about 1.5 million dollars, so there ya go.

[Jemeyes]

mathmatical error eh

it still pisses me off that there is Still so much government wastefull spending which could be used to fund the 35 million increse that could be put towards the children expanded health insurance instead of taxing smokers

[smallbird]

Not to mention all those government agencies who have wasted taxpayer dollars flying first class all over the world....